|
 Author | Topic: Players are a strange breed! (Read 233 times) |
zekeo
New Member
member is offline
Joined: Dec 2008
Gender: Male 
Posts: 9
Location: Pietermaritzburg, South Africa
Karma: 0 |  | Players are a strange breed!
« Thread Started on Jan 30, 2009, 2:01am » | |
We were trying to focus on our guys finishing layups using the correct hand and correct footwork etc. There were some issues in making the layups. We decided to let them use whatever hand, leg to finish.
My thinking was, maybe they are not finishing properly because they are using their weaker hand. Lets take the rules off the drill and let them finish with any hand they want. The only condition was they had to finish that is what the goal of basketball is surely.
You know what, there layup completion fell through the floor. They started taking wild running hook layups at the rim and forgetting all about the fundamentals of proper layup form. It was almost as if giving them carte blanche through their brains off balance. The mental discipline and concentration needed to do off hand layups was necessary to keep them focused on the game. To say I was a little shocked is an understatement. The next practice I reinstated the emphasis on proper layups and guess what our completion rate shot up dramatically.
So I learnt a lesson, practice does not make perfect, perfect practice makes perfect. Oh, and also that expectation placed on the players by the coach rubs off onto the players.
|
Zeke,
When the student is ready the teacher will appear... |
|
geekcyclist
Junior Member
member is offline
![[homepage]](http://s1.images.proboards.com/buttons/www_sm.gif)
Joined: Oct 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 64
Location: Utah
Karma: 2 | | Re: Players are a strange breed!
« Reply #1 on Jan 30, 2009, 2:05am » | |
We had players missing layups in our drills and acting like it was no big deal, which is very frustrating to the whole coaching staff. While on the road at a holiday tournament we were talking to the coaches at another school and they said they had the same problem until they brought out 'the board'.
The board is a 20-24" 2x4 wrapped in a towel and sitting on the sideline at half court. You miss a layup, you get a board - you have to push the board around the perimeter of the court. We are at better than 95% makes on our layups in drills now.
|
GeekCyclist
http://cyprusbasketball.net |
|
bruchu
Administrator
member is offline
![[avatar]](http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2299/2442995929_bda05b2cdd.jpg)
Coach, I don't feel so good... I think I swallowed a finger.
Joined: Sept 2007
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,457
Karma: 53 | | Re: Players are a strange breed!
« Reply #2 on Jan 30, 2009, 2:27am » | |
Jan 30, 2009, 2:05am, geekcyclist wrote:| The board is a 20-24" 2x4 wrapped in a towel and sitting on the sideline at half court. You miss a layup, you get a board - you have to push the board around the perimeter of the court. We are at better than 95% makes on our layups in drills now. |
|
I have to remember that one... 
|
The X's & O's of Basketball Blog
Follow me on Twitter
"The main ingredient of stardom is the rest of the team." -- John Wooden
![[image]](http://img388.imageshack.us/img388/1778/120x90mk0.gif) |
|
coachj444
Senior Member
member is offline
Joined: Feb 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 494
Karma: 12 | | Re: Players are a strange breed!
« Reply #3 on Jan 30, 2009, 12:33pm » | |
Interestingly enough, when I saw John Thompson speak at a Nike Clinic he began talking about his princeton-style offense and how they practice so many layups and finishing at the basket moves. The one thing he emphasized was that he DOES NOT CARE what hand and what foot you use for taking a layup. Their goal is to get the ball up as quickly as possible before a shot can be blocked or altered. They practice coming off the wrong foot with correct hand, the correct foot with the wrong hand etc etc. I'm not sure I agree with this philosophy but he's also dealing with greater talent - with that being said, however, I still see so many college games where these guys/girls use improper fundamentals and make so many mistakes and miss easy layups etc.
| |
|
mrwen
Senior Member
member is offline
Joined: Mar 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 328
Karma: 14 | | Re: Players are a strange breed!
« Reply #4 on Jan 30, 2009, 12:56pm » | |
I don't think it is that John Thompson doesn't care what hand or foot you use when shooting a layup, but that you have the ability to use all combinations of hands and feet when finishing.
| |
|
saxoncoach
Junior Member
member is offline
Joined: Jun 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 58
Karma: 0 | | Re: Players are a strange breed!
« Reply #5 on Jan 30, 2009, 1:13pm » | |
As I read the posts I think of a shooter who has the most unfundamental shot but it keeps going in. This player has practiced the shot so many times that he or she has it down. The same would ring true for any habit. If players practice the incorrect layups after a while they will have the skill down and will start to finish. Although as a coach I would like to have them learn the correct habits.
On a side note there is a benefit to learning how to shoot shots in different ways because a player may have to use a unfundamental move to complete the shot. If they have practiced it then the chance of the shot going in will be greater.
| |
|
zmaster44
New Member
member is offline
Joined: Aug 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 41
Karma: 0 | | Re: Players are a strange breed!
« Reply #6 on Jan 31, 2009, 8:57am » | |
Rick Torbett made mention of this in his Better Basketball's Scoring without the ball.
From my point of view, having coached Under 12's and Under 14's, I taught correct hand and correct foot on both sides. As the group progressed and go into their third and fourth years in the program, we moved on to some more unorthodox lay ups as described in this post.
After all, if a player shoots 100% on their lay ups, I wouldn't have thought that a coach would have a problem with their technique.
Cheers
Mike
| |
|
dpatrisso
Full Member
member is offline
Joined: Oct 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 141
Karma: 3 | | Re: Players are a strange breed!
« Reply #7 on Jan 31, 2009, 3:42pm » | |
My philosophy as a coach is that if a player is achieving success through less than perfect mechanics, than don't change a thing... I have seen many occassions when coaches are dead set on good mechanics and change a players style of doing things and it actually hurts them in the end. Isn't the whole goal putting the ball in the basket so who cares what it looks like on the whey there? Thoughts?
| |
|
mrwen
Senior Member
member is offline
Joined: Mar 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 328
Karma: 14 | | Re: Players are a strange breed!
« Reply #8 on Feb 1, 2009, 9:19am » | |
I am generally hands off, especially during the season. Sometimes in the off-season when I get together with the players and talk about what is to come, I will make adjustments, even to a high percentage shooter, to help a player get his shot off in games. If he has a slow shot, or a low/awkward release that prohibits him from shooting in games, even thought he has shot well in drills, than I think it makes sense to change it. By the way, shooting is one of the hardest things for me to teach. In addition to the many ideas of techniques out there, I am convinced the mind is the biggest part of shooting, and messing around with a kids head can be dangerous.
| |
|
commcoach
Junior Member
member is offline
Joined: May 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 79
Karma: 1 | | Re: Players are a strange breed!
« Reply #9 on Feb 3, 2009, 3:28am » | |
Jan 30, 2009, 12:33pm, coachj444 wrote:| Interestingly enough, when I saw John Thompson speak at a Nike Clinic he began talking about his princeton-style offense and how they practice so many layups and finishing at the basket moves. The one thing he emphasized was that he DOES NOT CARE what hand and what foot you use for taking a layup. Their goal is to get the ball up as quickly as possible before a shot can be blocked or altered. They practice coming off the wrong foot with correct hand, the correct foot with the wrong hand etc etc. I'm not sure I agree with this philosophy but he's also dealing with greater talent - with that being said, however, I still see so many college games where these guys/girls use improper fundamentals and make so many mistakes and miss easy layups etc. |
|
I think John Thompson is also assuming that his players CAN do fundamentally sound layups. Like the saying I've heard before; You have to know the rules before you can start breaking the rules.
| |
|
zekeo
New Member
member is offline
Joined: Dec 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 9
Location: Pietermaritzburg, South Africa
Karma: 0 | | Re: Players are a strange breed!
« Reply #10 on Feb 3, 2009, 6:54am » | |
While I agree with the basic premise of some of the replies there is something to be said about coaching fundamentally correct technique.
I'll give an analogy from Cricket which I know for allot of the people on here is an overseas sport.
Cricket is basically broken down into fielding, batting and bowling. Batting much like shooting a basketball has allot to do with muscle memory and timing. If a player uses incorrect technique he has to have his eye in all the time. So then what happens when his timing goes? A shot is normally played A-B-C but the incorrect technique throws in A-Q-B-C allot more things that need to happen to make a successful shot. The player with correct technique will ride through those slumps allot quicker because the issue is just timing and not an incorrect technique. Having correct technique ensures that there are less links in the chain that have to all line up for a perfect shot.
For pros who spend hours and hours shooting, some can afford to have horrible shots and get away with it i.e Tayshaun Prince and Shawn Marion. Can you imagine Marion coming of a screen and knocking down a jumper, sorry I can't. For an high school player who has other things on their plate having correct form allows a better bang for their buck so to speak in terms of the time invested.
I agree, trying to change mechanics during the season is practically impossible, but for the good of the players long term development correct form should be addressed.
I also agree, put the ball in the hoop, I don't care how just score. But, principles are principles and we not only are coaching basketball but shaping lives beyond the time that they spend with us. Are we not doing them a disservice by not doing anything?
|
Zeke,
When the student is ready the teacher will appear... |
|
|
![[Home]](http://s1.images.proboards.com/menu/home.gif)
![[Help]](http://s1.images.proboards.com/menu/help.gif)
![[Search]](http://s1.images.proboards.com/menu/search.gif)
![[Login]](http://s1.images.proboards.com/menu/login.gif)
![[Register]](http://s1.images.proboards.com/menu/register.gif)
![[Search This Thread]](http://s1.images.proboards.com/search2.gif)
![[Send Topic To Friend]](http://s1.images.proboards.com/buttons/sendtopic.gif)
![[Print]](http://s1.images.proboards.com/buttons/print.gif)
Logged